Why don't more prisoners sue the prison when they are sexually assaulted?

[primalclaws1974]

We all know prison are a haven for unwanted sexual advancements. But what I don't understand is why more people don't sue the prison and government tied to it? I had a friend who was assaulted while in state prison. He and two other people teamed together with their lawyers, and brought a case against the system. They won a cash settlement, because the prison didn't protect these three prisoners from the assault of another. The settlement wasn't huge, but they did come forward, and won. Why are there not more endings like this?

 

[admin]

Probably the biggest reason why this doesn't happen often, is it is hard to find attorneys to represent them. There are many people in jail who wouldn't be there if they could afford a good attorney. Then you have the difficulty of proving that it wasn't consensual. Often times prisons themselves have difficulty proving that an inmate was involved in a crime within the walls even with witnesses. I am sure you friend would tell you that even when you are in the right in prison you are in the wrong when it comes to the system.

I don't mean to put down the system but that is the way it is. Prisons become immune to compassion by necessity. Inmates by nature will push to see how far they can go so allot of things get overlooked.

 

[milyjohnson]

I agree. I think that the prisoners should do something about what is happening to them in prison. They shouldn't allow people to attack them like that. There are some people who are in there who were wrongfully convicted. I know it's easy to dismiss what is going on to them because they are in prison, but some people who are there are innocent of the crimes that put them in there. They do have rights and they are being violated so they should do something about it.

 

[primalclaws1974]

Thank you both for your answers. I feel that the general public as a whole contribute to the problem as well. If someone is accused of molestation or rape, the consensus view is that they are automatically guilty. If it is taken to trial the jury are regular people that are probably going to think the same way. How many people walk away from sexual molestation charges (that are still indictable)? The matter gets deeper when police are trained to get confessions from someone, at nearly any cost. I am not saying police are doing anything illegal, but their interrogation methods are "you're guilty, you're guilty, you're guilty". Once a person is in the system for a supposed sexual offense, there is no pity for them if they are attacked themselves. I have heard numerous views that it is exactly what they deserve.

 

[ally79]

Well it is well known that rapists and child molesters do not do well in prison and that they are routinely attacked by fellow prisoners. If you are in jail mistakenly on any kind of a sexual charge you are not going to have a good time. I am not saying that this is right, it is just a fact.

As far as the prisons protecting the prisoners, how do you propose they do that when they are staffed with about 1 guard for every 50 to 100 prisoners? They can't be everywhere at once and even though most prisons have cameras they don't cover every area. Prisoners are pretty good at figuring out where the cameras aren't.

 

[primalclaws1974]

Just because there are prisoners that can get around cameras doesn't mean it is acceptable for sexual assaults. Just because someone is a convicted sex offender, it does not mean that "understaffing" is a valid excuse to let them be attacked. The prison is responsible for the safety of the inmates that they house, no matter what their crimes. If a prison is overcrowded the right thing to do is to reduce the sentence for non-violent offenders. Letting harm come to them is unacceptable.

 

[LitoLawless]

I didn't even know that prisoners had that option. I just thought that all of their rights were taken away when they were thrown in jail. I know they have the right to an attorney, but I think it would be really hard to find one to represent them, hence they wouldn't even try. I think that it would be even harder if they went to jail for a rape or sexual assault charge.

 

[ally79]

I never said that it was right Primal, just that that is what happens. I absolutely agree that millions upon millions of non-violent drug offenders should be released thus saving room for the prisoners who really need to be in there. That would also reduce a lot of the staffing concerns making prisoners "safer". However, it is prison, there are lots of violent people all being housed together with the most basic of human rights stripped from them. Bad things are going to happen, should it be ignored? No, but currently the resources of what to do about it are very limited.

 

[pattycake]

What I get about prison is that it's a place for people with no consideration for others, which stands to reason why there's no consideration in prison. You're amongst your own kind, so you can't be given consideration that you couldn't see giving another. If a rapist is jailed, that person had no consideration for the raped, so why should there be any consideration for them against other rapists?

 

[missbishi]

It wouldn't surprise me if people were simply too ashamed to admit that they had been sexually assaulted by another man. A prison does have a duty of care towards its inmates and regardless of what a person might have done, nobody deserves to be raped.

 

[primalclaws1974]

What I get about prison is that it's a place for people with no consideration for others, which stands to reason why there's no consideration in prison. You're amongst your own kind, so you can't be given consideration that you couldn't see giving another. If a rapist is jailed, that person had no consideration for the raped, so why should there be any consideration for them against other rapists?

I thought the United States was civilized, Patty? I thought we didn't allow cruel and unusual punishments. What someone did to end up in prison has no (or should have no) bearing on the way they are treated in prison. The time you get and the security level of the facility you are put into are the only factors congruent to your crime, and those factors are deemed by the judge. No one else has the moral or legal right to add to your punishment. That includes police, guards, or other prisoners.

 

[admin]

I thought the United States was civilized, Patty? I thought we didn't allow cruel and unusual punishments. What someone did to end up in prison has no (or should have no) bearing on the way they are treated in prison. The time you get and the security level of the facility you are put into are the only factors congruent to your crime, and those factors are deemed by the judge. No one else has the moral or legal right to add to your punishment. That includes police, guards, or other prisoners.

You are assuming that the judge decides the conditions they must live under, which he doesn't. The judge is responsible for sentencing an inmate to time. The department of corrections and classification, decides how restrictive his sentence is going to be. You are also assuming that once a criminal ends up in prison that their life of crime stops. For the most part every inmate will continue to break the laws of the prison once they are in. Prisons are not allowed to be rehabilitative, prisons are basically time outs for inmates. You would have to define "civilized" when you are making an assumption. Is it civilized for someone to be arrested 38 times for burglary to be out on the streets? Is it civilized to stick someone in a cell, locked down 23 hours everyday? The prisons with the lowest recidivism rates are the ones that are most restrictive however most people would say they do not treat their prisoners fairly. In Arizona it is mandatory that inmates have access to a tv so maricopa county offers 2 channels, the disney channel and a religious channel. Inmates are made to wear pink (because they found that inmates were robbing each other for their white t shirts) and a large majority of them live in tents out in 120 degree temperatures. Inmates say that this treatment is not fair treatment but who should it be fair to? In my opinion I am more concerned that when they are released they do not rob me again. So if they have to live in uncivilized conditions to learn that breaking the law doesn't pay, to make me safe I am all for it.

 

[primalclaws1974]

I am well-aware of the prison in Arizona. It has been on TV many times. I would not consider those living conditions cruel, as long as people didn't get sick from being outside all the time. I understand what you are saying about repeat offenders, but that's not really the point to my thread. If a guy robbed one store or fifty, it wouldn't determine how the guards and inmates treated him. If a guy (innocent or guilty) comes in with a history of molestation, he's in serious danger from everyone around him, including the guards. I also understand that most of the time spent in prisons is punishment. Consequences like prison are not meant to be fun, but neither should they be physically threatening.

 

[missbishi]

I thought that the whole point of prison was not just punishment but rehabilitation too. After all, we need to know that a newly-released prisoner will not reoffend. Rehabilitation will not happen in a physically threatening environment, it will only increase anti-social behaviours.

 

[angorb15]

I am well-aware of the prison in Arizona. It has been on TV many times. I would not consider those living conditions cruel, as long as people didn't get sick from being outside all the time. I understand what you are saying about repeat offenders, but that's not really the point to my thread. If a guy robbed one store or fifty, it wouldn't determine how the guards and inmates treated him. If a guy (innocent or guilty) comes in with a history of molestation, he's in serious danger from everyone around him, including the guards. I also understand that most of the time spent in prisons is punishment. Consequences like prison are not meant to be fun, but neither should they be physically threatening.

I don't think the Serg is saying that there is no abuse in prison. Most inmates who enter prison don't enter as gay men. When faced with the prospect of spending the next 25 years in prison many inmates will look for sexual gratification from anyone who is week. That being said, they don't place someone who is facing 3 years in the same sell or block with someone who is facing 25 years. And someone who is doing 5 years will probably get out in 24 months so for the most part they are not going to risk catching a charge for a capital crime so they can get sentenced to 10 additional years.

Many people don't think that an inmate having to do real time is considered cruel, but I assure you that the inmates and family's of the inmates do. Even the ACLU fights for what they feel is cruel punishment. Why do they even offer commissary to inmates. Why take away someones freedom and then put them in a situation where they will have their belongings extorted. It is not because the prisons want them to have commissary, it only makes their job harder.

There truly is a notion that the people who broke the law and go to prison become angels once they go to jail or prison. All inmates try to get away with what ever they can all the time. In most instances people who go to prison because they are convicted of a sexual crime, are placed in a section of the prison with inmates of like crimes or protective custody.

Unfortunately prison is a revolving door and that is not because inmates are being put in harms way. If it was the same people would not keep going back.

 

[primalclaws1974]

I don't think the Serg is saying that there is no abuse in prison. Most inmates who enter prison don't enter as gay men. When faced with the prospect of spending the next 25 years in prison many inmates will look for sexual gratification from anyone who is week. That being said, they don't place someone who is facing 3 years in the same sell or block with someone who is facing 25 years. And someone who is doing 5 years will probably get out in 24 months so for the most part they are not going to risk catching a charge for a capital crime so they can get sentenced to 10 additional years.

Many people don't think that an inmate having to do real time is considered cruel, but I assure you that the inmates and family's of the inmates do. Even the ACLU fights for what they feel is cruel punishment. Why do they even offer commissary to inmates. Why take away someones freedom and then put them in a situation where they will have their belongings extorted. It is not because the prisons want them to have commissary, it only makes their job harder.

There truly is a notion that the people who broke the law and go to prison become angels once they go to jail or prison. All inmates try to get away with what ever they can all the time. In most instances people who go to prison because they are convicted of a sexual crime, are placed in a section of the prison with inmates of like crimes or protective custody.

Unfortunately prison is a revolving door and that is not because inmates are being put in harms way. If it was the same people would not keep going back.

Thank you for the post. I am trying to understand your point. Is it that inmates get what they deserve because they continue to break the law inside the prison? I feel it would be pretty hard to be completely law-abiding, and not risk your own neck. For example, if someone wanted drugs, and told you to get them, and you had the money and connections, it might be advisable to do it, or you might end up dead.

 

[admin]

Thank you for the post. I am trying to understand your point. Is it that inmates get what they deserve because they continue to break the law inside the prison? I feel it would be pretty hard to be completely law-abiding, and not risk your own neck. For example, if someone wanted drugs, and told you to get them, and you had the money and connections, it might be advisable to do it, or you might end up dead.

Inmates get better than they deserve. I have personal experience working in a prison. Inmates are not extorted for drugs, that is not how prison works. Inmates will be extorted for their commissary, extra food from the kitchen, sex, getting their laundry done by other inmates etc...

That being said this only happens because if any real controls are attempted to be put on them all the civil liberties groups say the inmates are being subject to cruel and unusual punishment. Most everybody in the US has heard of Marcopa county jail and their warden. The reason why is he pushes the limits in his state to try to make prison less desirable so criminals may think twice before committing their next crime.

There are two ways to control human behavior, one is by positive reinforcement an the other is negative reinforcement. Typically a criminal knows the difference between right and wrong so positive reinforcement has failed which is what put them in jail. That leaves negative reinforcement as the only option that is left. Look at the recidivism rate of people that end up with prison terms of less than 5 years, it is pretty high. Then look at the rate for people who have a sentence that starts with a letter (life). Lifers who get lucky enough to get out don't go back, why, they realize that life behind bars is not that hard for a few years but the prospect of facing the rest of their life behind bars is unbearable. Negative reinforcement works and could work on short timers also if the prisons were given the ability to add controls. Giving them commissary, allowing visitors, access to tv...? What kind of punishment is that.

It is funny to see how many inmates show up for prison the first day and start given other inmates high fives from their county or group that they knew from the street.

Criminals hurt you and I, they are costing you money and putting you in harms way, unfortunatley treating them with kid gloves is never going to work.

 

[Mackmax]

The prison system is awful, and more of these prisons need to be sued for things like this. I don't care if the person was a cocaine dealer, they do not deserve to be raped and shanked in the eye while a prison officer stands and watches with no remorse. I would think that the biggest reason why prisoners don't sue is because it is very hard to afford and find a good lawyer that will take their case, as it is very hard for a lawyer to convince the judge to make a prison pay millions to a man or woman who is a rapist/murderer. Once you're a prisoner, you're immediately dehumanized. People no longer see you as a loving father and husband. They see you as a monster, and therefore feel no remorse or sympathy towards you, even if the crime you committed was petty.

 

[angorb15]

The prison system is awful, and more of these prisons need to be sued for things like this. I don't care if the person was a cocaine dealer, they do not deserve to be raped and shanked in the eye while a prison officer stands and watches with no remorse. I would think that the biggest reason why prisoners don't sue is because it is very hard to afford and find a good lawyer that will take their case, as it is very hard for a lawyer to convince the judge to make a prison pay millions to a man or woman who is a rapist/murderer. Once you're a prisoner, you're immediately dehumanized. People no longer see you as a loving father and husband. They see you as a monster, and therefore feel no remorse or sympathy towards you, even if the crime you committed was petty.

What exactly do you feel they deserve? How would you run the prison, list what you would allow them to have/not have. Explain how you would enforce what the rules of what goes on in prison. It is really easy to blame the prison system for criminals continuing to be criminals but it is not easy to stop someone from being one that wants to be one. Do you really think that inmates are raped and stabbed in the eye in the presence of the guards? That would only put that guard in danger of retaliation by the inmate who was offended or by the inmate who committed the act. Do you think that a witness to the act is really going to snitch on another inmate? If you do you have no idea what prison is all about.

 

[primalclaws1974]

Inmates get better than they deserve. I have personal experience working in a prison. Inmates are not extorted for drugs, that is not how prison works. Inmates will be extorted for their commissary, extra food from the kitchen, sex, getting their laundry done by other inmates etc...

That being said this only happens because if any real controls are attempted to be put on them all the civil liberties groups say the inmates are being subject to cruel and unusual punishment. Most everybody in the US has heard of Marcopa county jail and their warden. The reason why is he pushes the limits in his state to try to make prison less desirable so criminals may think twice before committing their next crime.

There are two ways to control human behavior, one is by positive reinforcement an the other is negative reinforcement. Typically a criminal knows the difference between right and wrong so positive reinforcement has failed which is what put them in jail. That leaves negative reinforcement as the only option that is left. Look at the recidivism rate of people that end up with prison terms of less than 5 years, it is pretty high. Then look at the rate for people who have a sentence that starts with a letter (life). Lifers who get lucky enough to get out don't go back, why, they realize that life behind bars is not that hard for a few years but the prospect of facing the rest of their life behind bars is unbearable. Negative reinforcement works and could work on short timers also if the prisons were given the ability to add controls. Giving them commissary, allowing visitors, access to tv...? What kind of punishment is that.

It is funny to see how many inmates show up for prison the first day and start given other inmates high fives from their county or group that they knew from the street.

Criminals hurt you and I, they are costing you money and putting you in harms way, unfortunatley treating them with kid gloves is never going to work.

I appreciate the insider's viewpoint. I realize that inmates are no angels. I also understand that they will play the system and anyone that feels that they are being violated in some way. I am not saying I believe that a child-murderer should live an easy life behind bars. I am not saying I feel empathy for this particular person, either. What I am saying is that once we, as a society stop feeling that humans are unworthy of bare liberties, than we, ourselves are losing something.